Wednesday, June 12, 2013

Fact or Fiction?



By Jeff Simpson

I stumbled upon a discussion on facebook recently between a few people on the far right fringe of WI.  In it, they were discussing the popularity of different republicans in taking back the White House in 2016.  

This was the original discussion post:

Good news for Wisconsin Republican and Conservatives! Paul Ryan has the highest approval number and Walker comes in 7th. Also 2 Floridian's Marco Rubio and Jeb Bush at 3rd an 4th most favorable.

I am beginning to believe that Ryan is still our best shot..but Rand Paul does have a chance...I'll still need to see how he contrasts with the Dem's candidate and how the centrists take to Rand Paul. My fear is the press will force him into defending or denying his Father's ideas and positions, which will take up a lot of the energy Rand would need to make his positive case.

Thoughts?

Which of course led to them lamenting amongst themselves that the only way a democrat can win is election fraud and that no republican can win statewide until we enact voter ID because despite the republicans massive popularity in our state, the democrats just cheat.

Without taking the time to point out that the republicans control every branch of government in WI or a myriad of other facts, someone posted this as "proof" -


Mark Lahti Well Jeff. Just for starters. I followed three different vans with out of state plates carrying around the same groups of people from one polling place to another. They all went in and same day registered then voted. While inside watching same day registrants I observed them all using a letter that appeared to be a form letter as some some proof of residency. This went on all day. That was just one polling place in one city. These type of reports were coming in from all areas. Fraud was RAMPANT. I saw it first hand. The problem with the system is that there is vertically nothing you can do after the fact. Voter ID will go a long way to curtail this.
Ken Brown Mark is correct, until we get a Statewide election for Governor or President with full Voter ID in place, we'll not get a good handle on just who much fraud is going on out there.

So my question to YOU is....do you really think that van loads of people with "out of state" plates were driving polling place to polling place and voting in the last election?  

Fact or fiction?   






26 comments:

  1. I wouldn't even believe him if he showed photos or film. Too easy to alter.

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  2. Come On People Is This Really Our New Wisconsin ?

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    1. that would be what robin vos calls his base

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  3. Have them all sign here-http://stopmybenefits.com/site/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/form.jpg

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  4. Not a chance. Much more plausible that it's one of those 'confirmation bias' episodes where a low-information/sub-normal/fired-up tea-bagger actually observed "several fans" and really did follow them. But the events that were described as happening only did so within the over-heated cranial space of his or her own imagination. ...The Bush administration fired how many attorney's general, in how many states, for not pursuing "voter fraud" allegations -- like this one -- because there was nothing to investigate. ...Only they can never admit that.

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  5. If this guy was telling the truth, then he had plenty of time to take down the license plates of the vans and the polling places where they stopped. This would be strong evidence of voter fraud. However no one reported such occurrences. I have read this same musty story more than once. Right wingers are unable to do the critical thinking needed to quickly debunk the fairy tale.

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  6. Until we can compare an election cycle for Governor or President with a pre Voter ID Law or a post voter ID rule in place we'll simply have to presume that Jeff's assertion that fairies, sprites, unicorns, elves, giants, Illinesians and other fake voters are NOT participating in our elections.

    Racine is reknowned as a hotbed of repeated voting, and multiple address voting, (folks still registered at several different residences going into multiple precincts to vote on election day or by absentee, Madison and Milwaukee as well). Signing of the registers will be very helpful in locating these cheaters. Also the absentee ballot requests via mail are another tool that has been used for decades to "stuff the ballot box".

    I am glad we will have voter ID in place for next Spring and Fall elections. We can compare 2010, 2012 recall with the 2014 Gov result. Should give us a good start.

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    1. "Racine is reknowned as a hotbed of repeated voting, and multiple address voting, (folks still registered at several different residences going into multiple precincts to vote on election day or by absentee, Madison and Milwaukee as well)"

      You of course have some evidence of this I'm sure, as you certainly wouldn't have us just rely upon your clearly unbiased opinion right? Please feel free to present that evidence to support your claim at any time.

      "Until we can compare an election cycle for Governor or President with a pre Voter ID Law or a post voter ID rule in place we'll simply have to presume that Jeff's assertion that fairies, sprites, unicorns, elves, giants, Illinesians and other fake voters are NOT participating in our elections. "

      "We can compare 2010, 2012 recall with the 2014 Gov result. Should give us a good start. "

      Actually no, it won't. All it will tell us is whether or not voter ID laws are effective at disenfranchising certain voting groups to the point the it affects turnout at the polls. Voter ID laws disproportionately affect younger voters, poor, and minorities (particularly Latinos). What do those voters all have in common? Yeah, you guessed it, they tend not to vote for the same groups pushing for (and enacting) voter ID laws. Wow must be some strange coincidence huh? In your world then, if laws designed to reduce turnout amongst those voters. reduces turnout amongst those voters, that equates to proof of prior voter fraud? What a brilliant hypothesis.

      So yeah, keep convincing yourself that the right wing is increasingly unable to win national elections due to wide spread voter fraud, even though no actual evidence of any fraud turns up. You should make these claims of fraud while pushing for laws that institutionalize increased voting restrictions, limitations, and disenfranchisement. To further your laughable hypocrisy, tell everyone how much you love freedom and hate governmental overreach and infringement on individual rights. Maybe you could even get a tattoo of a flag, or possibly an eagle. That should help lend an air of legitimacy to your claims I think. Good luck!

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    2. BS Shane, A review of the result in officially ID screened election will, over a few cycles, might show a lower turnout, and I expect that drop off turnout will be in areas where population is fluid and dense, Milwaukee, Racine and Kenosha. I have been researching the techniques for quite a few years. Voters given slips of paper with names that were falsely registered or using several addresses where they may have lived over numerous years. Despite efforts to clear the roles of fakers. We have seen this in Ohio, Missouri, and WI and other state. We had the guy in Racine during the recall, registering and forging his neighbors, mother, and deceased fathers names in order to corrupt the election process, he was found guilty of a Felony.
      I am confident the "Right" and Left will adjust to the integrity of cleaner elections. If the Right does suddenly better, then the left will shift it's focus a little to embrace more of the "centrists". But at the end of the day voter ID will dramatically reduce fraud, a few years will go by and the voter roles will be purged of fake persons and the deceased.

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    3. I see. When challenged on your claims, you choose not to present evidence. Nope, why would that be necessary? Instead, double down on the assertions, cite your own anecdotal evidence complete with claims of expertise, and restate the same initial claim. Nice work! still ridiculous and completely hypocritical, but I'm sure it's impressive enough in your circles.

      Let me again ask, where is your evidence of all this massive voter fraud that you claim exists? What evidence is there that voter ID laws will curb said fraud? You stating it to be the case doesn't make it so. You claiming to have researched it doesn't constitute evidence. You have made numerous claims of voter fraud in multiple states. Again, where is your evidence? "A guy in Racine" is not evidence of voter fraud. Even taking you on your word that that claim is accurate, at best, it is evidence of a single individual forging recall signatures. How would a voter ID law have changed that? You do not get to make silly, unverifiable claims and not get challenged on them. If you're unable to provide evidence beyond your own say so, you cannot be taken seriously.

      I still say get a flag tattoo. It would be far greater evidence of your claims than you have thus far presented.


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    4. This CRACKED me up:

      I am confident the "Right" and Left will adjust to the integrity of cleaner elections. If the Right does suddenly better, then the left will shift it's focus a little to embrace more of the "centrists".

      Obviously the republicans have taken over our state because they are so moderate and such centrists.

      talk about crack a rib laughing!

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  7. I am going with fiction. Or LIE if you prefer. I do not trust the testimony of any one who does not know the difference in "virtually" and "vertically".

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  8. So THAT'S how Walker won re-election!! I knew it couldn't be legally!!

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  9. You could have vans rented in Chicago driving around (say, Kenosha or Racine) Wisconsin voters to register and vote. How is that "proof" of anything? More like circumstantial evidence and a non-supported conclusion requiring a great deal of other inferences...

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  10. He watched someone commit a crime and did nothing? He should be reported for aiding and abetting.

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  11. well yes, the fraud took place at the Waukesha county clerks office for both teh S.Ct. election and recall. I have the same proof the guy tailing the "van loaded with ppl"

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  12. All Bullshit. These story tellers were in front of the GAB last year. I watched to two hour long deal on WIS EYE. Its all bullshit. Never happened Each and every story told about all this fraud was so shot full of holes by everyone on the panel, Even those in the audience. Paper ballot yes. so there is a paper trail YES !! Agreed by ALL election officials. But fraud the goof ball story tellers speak of.. Never happened

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  13. I guess that explains how so many Republicans got elected in WI the last election.

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  14. More likely the mythical van with out of state plates was actually hauling around rightwinger "Polling station observers." As we've seen repeatedly over the past two years, the Walker gang is dependent on out of state mercenaries to keep power.

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  15. Both vans had beloit baptist church plasterd all over both sides of both vans. The south beloit branch of the church owned the vans. Thats why they had illinois plates. They were picking up old folks from the nursing homes to go vote. This was proven 20 times over by ALL election officials !

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  16. I saw that van. It was the one with "We Stand With Walker" bumper sticker.

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  17. He contradicted his own "facts" - first he said he followed them around from one polling place to another, then he says "this was just at one polling place" and REPORTS of this supposedly occurring elsewhere "were coming in" all day. Well, which is it? Did he personally follow them from one place to another, and if so, why didn't he report them - or did he see it at one place and get reports of it occurring elsewhere?

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  18. Each individual same-day registration would require a Wisconsin Drivers License or 'Voter ID' ID number; if the person applying doesn't have one, then the last four digits of their Social Security number.

    In addition, each would have to show a document to 'demonstrate residence' in the particular precinct - a phone bill, bank statement, rental lease - that shows their name and the address they are registering at. If the poll worker is doing their job, some identifying info such as the individual account number is also written down on the individual registration form.

    Now, if they are all using the 'same form letter' to somehow show multiple addresses in the same precinct, and then more addresses in the next precinct, AND multiple different account numbers....that is one magical form letter.

    And then those registration forms go to the election clerk's office and/or the GAB, where the info is input into the computers... where any duplicate addresses and account numbers would quickly become quite obvious, and which would soon be followed by phone calls to local DAs and state's attorneys, etc etc.

    No. That didn't happen.

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  19. Voter ID does not stop voter fraud. What it does is keep some citizens from voting.

    What will clean up the problem of invalid or inaccurate voter registrations is the automation of the administration of voter registration rolls. You NEVER hear that from Republicans. That is because the goal of Republicans is voter suppression, not clean elections.

    The Pew Center on the States has an excellent report on the topic.
    http://www.pewtrusts.org/uploadedFiles/wwwpewtrustsorg/Reports/Election_reform/Pew_Upgrading_Voter_Registration.pdf

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